Tuesday, November 15, 2011

Why the NWO Might Actually Win - #130 Otpor!



gyg3s said...

The BBC's take on it can be found here, Gene Sharp: Author of the nonviolent revolution rulebook

paul said...

I wonder if he's advising the occupy movements just now?

Edo said...

Play the game
Show your name
Insurance claim
Yourself to blame

No Thanks!

Bridget said...

Here's the risk: Occupy ends up doing the bidding of the global elite | Patrick Henningsen | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

Although the global Occupy movement has branched out in an open-source way, many of its participants and spectators might be completely unaware of who actually launched it. Upon investigation, what one finds is a daisy chain of non-profit foundations, all tied together by hundreds of millions per year in operational funding. The original call for Occupy Wall Street came from non-profit international media foundation Adbusters. Like many non-profits, Adbusters receives its funding and operating capital from other behind-the-scenes organisations. According to research conducted by watchdog Activistcash, Adbusters takes a significant portion of its money from the Tides Foundation, an organisation partnered with one of Wall Street billionaire oligarch George Soros's foundations, the Open Society Institute.

Edo said...

And it's not just Adbusters....

This group have interesting connections too.


Especially when you see when and who registered this address...


And who happens to share that address????

The Lucis Trust. (formerly The Lucifer Publishing Company) I shit you not.

Bridget said...

Good info Edo - although I didn't find the Lucis Trust registered at that address. Do you have a link? I only found someone on a forum claiming this address was in a Freemasonary book. I do so love to check my sources.

15october then made the registration anonymous and issued this:

October 18th, 2011.
Due to the immense interest that this question has posed, we thought we might as well answer it: we do not want to feed paranoia and senseless New World Order conspiracies. Some of you were smart enough to find the registration details, and some of you looked closely enough to find one of the actual members out of the large group that planned the page. Paulina Arcos, who figures as the owner of the domain, is the name of the mother of this member. We used her credit card to purchase the domain in July. When we did this we had no idea of the impact that it would have, and if we had known it we would have definitely left family out of it. When we conceived the site, it was more of a dream than a reality.
We are just some of the many activists from around the world who worked to prepare the 15th of October protest. The web-page remained “anonymous” because we always believed that the ideas behind it belonged to anyone who recognized themselves in them. This movement is not guided, it is clearly born as a reaction to injustice and corruption around the world, and therefore it is destined to change the underlying values of the system, not only the rules of it. It is a global movement for true democracy and better human conditions, so this website reflects a collective idea, a movement without borders or leaders.
We are not responsible or representatives of any group. We are people who decided to participate in a web-platform for a social movement which rose up sponteneously.

Stef said...

It's worth noting that http://15october.net/ was registered on 12th July

Hmmm, super-spontaneous

Stef said...

tbh It's surprising to me that anyone could think that actions which are so obviously planned and co-ordinated are in any way 'grass roots' based or spontaneous

Admittedly, we haven't seen the mass produced TV-friendly flags, banners and all the other spontaneous grass roots paraphernalia we've come to expect when things kick off in E. Europe or the the Middle East, but I supposed that would be a little too obvious

Though I do wonder what the plan is should any of these spontaneous grass root movements actually acquire a life of their own. Not that there's much sign of that happening just right now

Bridget said...

The material conditions will remain whether the occupiers do or not. Solutions need to be found.

Interesting that 'non-violence' and 'democracy' are the memes - whereas violent uprisings or outright naked aggression are supported to bring 'democracy' to Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq etc. At the same time democracy is set aside in Italy in favour of a non-elected government - the ante-chamber to dictatorship?

Stef said...

"Solutions need to be found"

I've no doubt that some very active and inventive minds are working on that problem

On both sides of the equation

Tony Mach said...

I think you (or this video) overestimates the importance of these groups.

What do we have?

1.) People who organize for their perceived common interests.
(Not surprising)

2.) People who act against their own interests (while perceive this as their own interest).
(Surprising for some people, maybe)

3.) Capitalists/Imperialist scumbags who know their interests, find and finance people who help them realize their interests (see 2 for reference)
(OMG! I can't believe capitalists do that!)

4.) The subversion of word and symbols ("Revolution" or the raised fist) either knowingly (see 3 for reference) or unknowingly (see 2 for reference).
(Again, for some this is a surprise)

According to Lenin, one needs three things for a revolution situation (where the status quo is untenable): The ruling class ("top") can't go on ruling (e.g. because of a crisis), the ruled ("those on the bottom") don't want to go on like that. There is unusual hardship. A sharp spike in unrest. Further on, for a revolutionary situation to become a revolution, you need a driving force.

Now, for a counterrevolution to draw back the wheel of time (in favor of the top), you basically have the same conditions. I wouldn't be surprised if there are think-tanks who think exactly along these lines, and how to accelerate each step. I only would be surprised if they would use this (marixist-leninist) terminology.

I don't think standing there like Donald Sutherland, point the finger and screaming "AHHHHHHHH!" is going to help. Expose their language, Expose in whose interests they act (knowingly or unknowingly). And most of all: Express our own interests.

Tony Mach said...

It's worth noting that http://15october.net/ was registered on 12th July

Hmmm, super-spontaneous

Well, while I know very little about the 15.oct thing, it is not uncommon (as I have seen in the peace movement) to plan larger events or demonstrations half a year ahead (or even longer). And that we have a financial crisis isn't a thing that happened yesterday.

That people organize, that people use the same slogans, or even the same banners is not a necessary sign that a protest is "organized" by a shadowy cabal – it is just a sign that they are organized. Ask about whose interests they serve, don't focus on the secondary question how they organize.

Stef said...

"Ask about whose interests they serve, don't focus on the secondary question how they organize"

From what I can see they just want more of the same, only weighted more in favour of their self-interest

Very few people would choose to be the Donald Sutherland character but I've tried to engage some of these characters and we may as well come from different planets

A revolutionary changed may be achieved by given them what they want, whatever that is exactly, but only because that will help the existing system on its way over the cliff a little bit quicker

I doubt that it is what most of them have in mind

Stef said...

Bridget frequently says that it's all 'process' and it is unfair to criticise people on the start of a learning journey. Fair enough

But I smell foundation founded sticky fingers all over these protests and, yes, I am asking myself what is it they expect to achieve with their involvement?

My first answers are

- More government
- To serve as a lightning rod
- To have an influence over the inevitable unrest and whatever opposition arises from that

but these are only preliminary conclusions/ suspicions

Bridget said...

The 'process' Stef is the class struggle - who will pay for the crisis of Capitalism?

The real problems consist of a lack of a revolutionary leadership putting forward the correct demands. There is a struggle though, as long as there are classes. The current State repression of protest also plays its part in the process of raising consciosness.

If capitalism is incapable of satisfying the demands inevitably arising from the calamities generated by itself, then let it perish. “Realizability” or “unrealizability” is in the given instance a question of the relationship of forces, which can be decided only by the struggle. By means of this struggle, no matter what immediate practical successes may be, the workers will best come to understand the necessity of liquidating capitalist slavery.


What Tony missed from Lenin's list was revolutionary leadership. That these groups tend towards saying that no ideology or leadership is necessary - only vague demands for democracy or solutions such as the Robin Hood tax - says something about whether Reformism still has a material base. I think not.

Edo said...

When protests were protests.

none of this nancy-girl stuff.

Stef said...

Thanks Edo

A picture of Mr Sqwubbsy found nestled in that link sparked off a pleasant reverie and a chain of thought featuring the several highlights in my life associated with Julian Cope

But I still think the same thing about the Big Kick Off I thought back then - it might have been good fun n' all but it didn't achieve very much

Anonymous said...

re: lucis trust & 15october.net domain registration.


Looks like someone did a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domains_by_Proxy on it since paulina took her snapshot.


If indeed she didn't hoax it, not sure what site she went to.