tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post112676448233224802..comments2023-10-18T16:25:13.593+01:00Comments on Famous for 15 megapixels: Baby Jesus gets terrible pressStefhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01467757421113856218noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1127127368266511192005-09-19T11:56:00.000+01:002005-09-19T11:56:00.000+01:00@dom: With stuff like this I don't believe anyone'...@dom: With stuff like this I don't believe anyone's going to prove anyone else 'right' or 'wrong'. The debate is the important part and the more open minded and less hysterical the better. That's what makes the nature of the debate in America so depressing<BR/><BR/>Right Wing? Left Wing? Those notions are history. It's about Them and Us. Them, representing something like 0.1% of humanityStefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01467757421113856218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1127127097446588892005-09-19T11:51:00.000+01:002005-09-19T11:51:00.000+01:00NMNot looking to displease anyone with the post an...NM<BR/><BR/>Not looking to displease anyone with the post and I think that those who've read this understand that.<BR/><BR/>And I'm defintely not trying to be a smart arse on this subject. It's too important.<BR/><BR/>You cite 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you' as being a code that does not need to be anchored in concepts such as good and evil.<BR/><BR/>How's that?<BR/><BR/>A code like that is in total opposition to Darwinism. That actually was the point I was trying to get at.<BR/><BR/>If living things followed that 'do unto others' stuff competition and evolution would stop. It's, in Darwinist terms, an unnatural law.<BR/><BR/>I you disagree with that observation I genuinely would like to know how/why?<BR/><BR/>I agree that evolution and the generation/creation of life are two completely separate processes. Some creationists are even happy to live with the concept of some form of evolution. However, evolution absolutely requires some, as yet unproven, mechanism to deliver that first spark of life to work on. A naturalist explanation for the origin of live is a key assumption underlying evolutionary theory.<BR/><BR/>But, anyway, in the nicest possible way I think you've missed my point. Whatever the details may be, there really are only two views of the universe<BR/><BR/>- It was made deliberately<BR/>- It just happened<BR/><BR/>If it just happened there really is no purpose to anything. If it were amde deliberately there presumably is a purpose and all religions represent crude attempts to divine that purpose.<BR/><BR/>So I'm not sure how my argument loses traction. Again, if you could explain why/how I'm genuinely keen to hear back from youStefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01467757421113856218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1127079326357560262005-09-18T22:35:00.000+01:002005-09-18T22:35:00.000+01:00I'm finding more and more that it's less about pro...I'm finding more and more that it's less about proving you are right or changing people's minds than it is about the arguement. On a different note, would you think of yourself as right wing at all?Domhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16583775220169709120noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126805775828424202005-09-15T18:36:00.000+01:002005-09-15T18:36:00.000+01:00de: I don't think the giraffe is that difficult a ...de: I don't think the giraffe is <I>that</I> difficult a case; if anything, you're making it difficult for yourself by assuming that its niche is deep and sharp-edged.<BR/><BR/>You're thinking in terms of "short giraffes die, tall giraffes live"; but I'd suggest that it's more the case that "taller giraffes do slightly better than shorter ones". After all, giraffes seem to get through childhood just fine...<BR/><BR/>(There may also have been an arms race between the giraffes and the trees they like to eat, driving them both to greater heights?)<BR/><BR/>stef: the problem is not that "neoconservative fundamentalist Christians are just about the least Christian people on the planet"; the problem is that <I>they believe they're the most Christian people in the planet</I> and then use that belief to cherrypick only those passages in the Bible that support their worldview.<BR/><BR/>I'd argue, too, that "Mongo strong, Mongo take your hamburger" is still very much in force today; only today it's "George rich. George powerful. George take your money. George children privileged. George children grow up protected. George children run world." <BR/><BR/>Survival of the fittest, in this society, is less about physical power, more about fiscal and political power; if you're poor and powerless, your children are less likely to survive to adulthood.<BR/><BR/>Hmm, that came out bleaker than I intended.<BR/><BR/>Finally, yes: while I'm a firm Darwinist, I too often find Dawkins an insufferably arrogant ass.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01502072746955166120noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126789130410082552005-09-15T13:58:00.000+01:002005-09-15T13:58:00.000+01:00sparkling: :)de: A long post and thanks for gettin...sparkling: :)<BR/><BR/>de: A long post and thanks for getting to the end of it. Thank you also for not behaving like Richard Dawkins. The man has things to say that are worth listening to but his arrogance is sometimes just beggging for a good pinching.<BR/><BR/>I'm a platypus man myself.<BR/><BR/>Of course you're totally correct, Darwinism doesn't preclude relgious faith one little bit. It could simply be the mechanism chosen by the Creator.<BR/><BR/>I liked your lines<BR/><BR/>'It would appear that survival of the fittest is a horrible moral code. So humanity needs religious faith to enshrine superior moral doctrines. But then science never did care about the consequences. Thats for others to work out.'<BR/><BR/>particularly the last part. I shall steal it one of these days.Stefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01467757421113856218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126787355360959972005-09-15T13:29:00.000+01:002005-09-15T13:29:00.000+01:00While I am a Dawkins atheist, my favourite difficu...While I am a Dawkins atheist, my favourite difficult case animal is the giraffe.<BR/><BR/>If the giraffe has the right length neck now, why did it not die out when it had evolved to only half the height and couldn't reach the right leaves? If it didn't have long enough legs, it would fall over. So it must have evolved a neck and legs at the same rate. How did it survive through this process? Where are the short giraffe ancestors?<BR/><BR/>Frankly its easier to believe in god given design. The designer was just heavily into variation. 5 million different insect species at last count - maybe a designer with attention deficit syndrome?<BR/><BR/>Principled attack on Darwinism has not been helped by Literal Christian rejection. Not many people want to stand shoulder to shoulder with these guys. However, scientists are too keen to repeat that life started in deepest Africa - they know how that titilates. The theory of evolution is exactly that, a theory. Its doing well; but probably needs another century to mature.<BR/><BR/>There is no reason for Darwinism to effect religious faith whatsoever - Darwin was of course god fearing. When religious texts are taken as factual reports, then faith becomes more entrenched. <BR/><BR/>It would appear that survival of the fittest is a horrible moral code. So humanity needs religious faith to enshrine superior moral doctrines. But then science never did care about the consequences. Thats for others to work out.DEhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13468138772103258101noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126774059290207012005-09-15T09:47:00.000+01:002005-09-15T09:47:00.000+01:00I still think the egg came before the chicken.I still think the egg came before the chicken.Sparklinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04334915032148361564noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126765095791151772005-09-15T07:18:00.000+01:002005-09-15T07:18:00.000+01:00sometimes long things are pleasurable, sometimes n...sometimes long things are pleasurable, sometimes notStefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01467757421113856218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8225855.post-1126764919742682242005-09-15T07:15:00.000+01:002005-09-15T07:15:00.000+01:00strange, i read most of it , it was kinda long tho...strange, i read most of it , it was kinda long though haha and its 2am :)<BR/>aaronemergen-c-manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12618031607215015351noreply@blogger.com